Renaissance Square Bamboozle Continues
Posted by Jeff Pruitt - 7/14/09 @ 11:58 am - Filed Under Featured, Local Politics, Uncategorized
Mayor Henry has tried to frame the debate over Renaissance Square between doing nothing or paying $14.5 Million for a new location. His strategy is quite simple - he hopes the public will agree that the police staying in their current location is unacceptable. Then he wants you to think that the only other option is to dramatically overpay for the Renaissance Square property.
But this really is nonsense. This entire move is being proposed because the police want out of their current headquarters. However, the FWPD isn’t big enough to fill Renaissance Square so the mayor wants to move everyone. That is illogical. Last time I looked around there were numerous empty buildings (big box stores included) that were littering this city. Why must we move everyone into this overpriced behemoth? Why not just relocate the police?
And think about these numbers too. The county is looking at spending roughly $3.5 million to build a new headquarters for the Sheriff’s department yet mayor Henry claims it would cost ~$20 million for the FWPD to do the same. Does that make sense? Shouldn’t somebody, I don’t know say somebody from the local media, ask him about this discrepancy?
And to top it off Pat Roller reinforces the observation that the city has some of the worst negotiators around:
Roller said that if the city doesn’t buy the building by the end of October, it would have to put additional money in escrow for it and only has until the end of the year to lock in the agreement.
So we have to ram this down the taxpayers’ throats before we lose the deal of the century? Is she serious? Why the hell are we wasting taxpayer dollars on escrow for this building? It has no viable commercial tenants and it hasn’t for years. Do you really believe these years of vacancy, and facing what will inevitably be the nation’s worst commercial real estate market in history, that the city is going to have this building sold out from underneath them?
We’re watching this bamboozle grow from the ground up; the real question is can we stop it?
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24 Responses to “Renaissance Square Bamboozle Continues”
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You really think the Sheriff can build a new building for $3.5 million?
hahahahahahahahaha.
No way. Further, if the purpose of this building is to simply replace the building out north, it has about 80 officers working out of it. The FWPD is much larger.
The real question is why would the Sheriff build a new HQ in the middle of nowhere (relatively speaking) when 70% of his staff works within 2 blocks of the city county building?
And lets be sure the county includes the cost of rehabbing the building on New Haven Ave. in their projections- that is the future home of the health department. And it will add to the county’s operational expense, just like the Keystone Building, the Building Dept., the probation office on the landing, etc.
Wow…how can anyone do business with the county when they are spread all over the place?
So how much money have we paid into this escrow account?
Mike Sylvester
I just looked over the County’s proposed numbers- it appears that they overlooked the fact that they could save money be relocating several of their offices into the CCB.
How much are the operational expenses for all those buildings and WHY did the commissioners not include them?
The Commissioners have known for over a year that they city was considering a move- why didn’t they develop a contingency plan??
[...] I discussed in the previous post the mayor is trying to frame the Renaissance Square debate into their proposal or nothing which is [...]
Answers to some of Kevin’s questions and some general comments-
1. It is true that the County knew there were thoughts of parts of the City moving but I would argue that the City sprang this on the County as a fait acompli even though it has not been considered or approved by the City Council(at this time I would guess Council approval would be at best a tossup).
2.I suspect the County did not include numbers from other buildings because they have no good idea what the buildings could be sold for -without that all you have is savings of utilities and maintenance costs.
3. The City numbers for renovating and operating the 200 E. Berry property are no better than back-of-the envelope estimates based on 4.50 and 33.00 per square foot of space. The operating costs for the Library were about $5.00/foot in 2006 so the estimate of $4.50 is probably light.Renovations could cost substantially more than $33 per sq. ft.
4.Much of the space needed by the police is for records storage-fire proof secure warehouse space would be much cheaper than the R Square building for that purpose.
5. The R Square bldg would have much more space than the City needs now-Roller said it would provide all the space needed for 20 years. In the meantime the excess space is a waste of taxpayer money.
6. It is a sham to say “no tax increase” when 25-30 million of Cedit tax money will be used for this project. Taxes are taxes and these funds could be used for development or to reduce the burden of other types of taxes and user fees.This is the same type of fuzzy math used on H Square.
7.Another great job of negotiating as Jeff points out-where was Brody et al when we needed someone to give the store away without a deadline?
8. Why does the City need to buy new furniture? With all the business closures etc good used furniture(including cubicles etc)is available for a song and the existing furniture can and should be used. When times are tough and salaries are frozen is not the time to be WASTING tax money!!
L. Marine,
Remember when the waste of tax dollars was spent on the library and Jeff Krull spent almost $700 for Aeron chairs for the staff members? Why break tradition?
Lockwood-
1. The city did not “spring” anything on the county. The Commissioners moved forward and spent money to develop plans for a new Sheriff’s facility, even though the city had begun “making noises” about moving out- according to a June 18 article in the Journal Gazette.
Further, Graham Richard had proposed the idea of moving during his term. The County just did what it always does- NOTHING!
2. Forget selling the buildings- give them away and get them back on the tax rolls- instant gain and a boost to economic development! Even if you do not do that- there is a cost savings from NOT having to clean them, keep lights on, etc.
You know, I am fine if we do not move the City out of the CCB. Let’s spend $22 million building a new HQ for the police….DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
This thread is a great example of what I have said for sometime- the administration has a plan that saves money for taxpayers- and there are still naysayers!
Knuth says “Give the buildings away,” LMAO.
Sure, let’s just give them to Bill Bean, he’ll make them work by moving lawyers from outside the city into them and make a tidy profit.
What was it Forest Gump’s mother always said..?
Kevin,thank you again wormtongue.
jb- Gotta resort to name calling? That means I win! Thanks!!!
Abe, I put the “give them away free” line in there knowing that if I did not someone would say “you cannot sell buildings in this market”. Mind you, that is NOT true if you are talking about Harrison Square- those are simply the fault of the developer (I just resorted to the “Kalb Rule”).
The bottom line is that the administration is planning for 20 years out- and that is a GOOD THING. The County is worried about immediate concerns- and not looking at the big picture.
And were is everyone going to park?Well lets see,after much publick debate and disapproval the city will bulid a new parking garage because the lack of spaces,and someones law firm or brother-in-law will make out like a bandit.And someone will be telling us what a good thing it was.
This morning’s paper includes this line: “Peters said if the mayor agrees the ocunty proposal is worth pursuing, the commissioners would work with the sheriff to find the best solutions for his needs”.
I’ll wager that Fries will use this opportunity to get tax money for his driving course / shooting range.
More county tax money being spent….where is the outrage?
The outrage is focused at all out of touch politicians.There is no accountability.And politicians could care less.
Waaaay too much time is being spent on these silly proposals to move government offices around. It is a big, wasteful shell game. The freight train approaching at high speed is the budget revenue shortfalls, which neither the city or county appears to be aware of. Property taxes, income taxes, fuel taxes, and excise taxes are all going to be falling far short of budgets, meaning there needs to be big time cuts in local government. Our neighbors to the north in South Bend just passed a local income tax to address a $30 million budget deficit issue. While that may not be the solution for us, I fear the Fort will be under siege shortly and we need to be discussing those issues, not looking to expand government operations in new or remodeled buildings.
Parking is addressed on page 20:
http://www.cityoffortwayne.org/images/stories/finance/controller/files/200Berry_St/rq_presentation.pdf
Kevin-There are several problems with this project but the principle 2 are the City looking at supposed savings for the City only when we are all County taxpayers and there are NO savings for City and County combined but large increases in expenditures. You say that there are naysayers when the City proposes to SAVE money-the concept that they are generating savings by counting only property taxes in the equation and using probably low back-of-the envelope estimates of operating expenses and renovation costs for R Square and high numbers for a new or remodeled police facility are not only disingenious but frankly are just plain dishonest !!This is the same sham used with H Square and those who use it should be ashamed of themselves!! Do they think we taxpayers just fell off the turnip truck? The proposal by your numbers guru shows clearly that total cost of the project will be 27 million-whether it comes from property tax,CEDIT,or whereever it is still taxpayer dollars which should be used for other purposes or used to reduce total taxes when the City is facing property tax reductions of millions of dollars,City employees are under a salary freeze and taxpayers have trouble making ends meet.If the police need more space lets find a way to do it without spending 27 million or getting more space at R Square than the City can use for several years.
Lockwood,
The issue I have with this is simple- the City has found a way to save money.
The county can do the same. They have at least 4 locations downtown that they work out of- the Probation dept. on the landing, small claims court on Berry St., The Prosecutor in the Keystone Building, and the building dept. on Superior.
Add to that the proposed NEW Health Dept. on New Haven Ave. (which will need more money for remodeling) and the proposed Sheriff’s office (mnium $3.5 million).
Move them (or keep them in the case of the Health Dept.) into the CCB. Sell the rest of the buildings and REDUCE operating expenses.
The County’s proposal does NOT address ANY of these other buildings (other than saying the Sheriff will not get a “stand alone” building, rather, they will relocate to RS).
So the city saves money and I would think that the county would be able to sell those 5 buildings for at least $10 million- add in the Sheriff’s office and you have saved $13.5 million not including maintenance and operating expenses.
I think taxpayers come out ahead with the administrations proposal.
The County Commissioners don’t want to work with the City government and they do not care about city residents. This was proven by the irresponsible manner in which they handled the issue of bridge repairs last year.
Given that County has proven not to be a team player, I think Mayor Henry has no choice but to make his decision based soley upon cost to the city, rather than cost to the county as a whole.
The move to Renaissance Square should be based upon a cost-benefit analysis of the effects it will have upon City government. If the best solution through this method causes a hardship for the county, then that is something the Commissioners will have to work out themselves.
It is simply not fair to expect ther Mayor to give consideration to the county when they have shown they give no consideration to the city.
Again… I have to agree with Kevin. The county, it seems, is looking for a win/win. The commissioners may not have all the answers, but it seems that they are willing to work jointly on a solution. That said, I can see where an agreement may not be possible, since the city really has no reason to consider what is in the best interest of county residents. (or do they?)
Mr Morrison the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior regardless of blah blah blah what we are going to do.Until the time is right to do what they want.I worked for the city for 34 years in publick safety.I know the BS that has gone on.
If Harrison Square is a boondogle, and Renaissance Square is a bamboozle, what is Freiman Square? A boonboozle, or a bamdoggle?
It would be better to put Allen County Police and Fort Wayne Police in the City County building together on either the third and/or fourth floor and the basement of the City County Building and then move some of the Administrative Offices not to Renaissance Square but to the old Offices across the street on Calhoun
This also leads back to my personal thoughts that all public safety officers should be under the County Sheriff as the Constitutionally appointed and dually elected Chief Executive Officer in charge of Public Safety!
It is time to merge the City police and the County police under the Sheriff and then apportion the Police force by the Township needs under a Deputy Constable per Township and thereby assessing the County Police budget from the Township level of government and remove the City all together from the politics of policing.
As far a public oversight goes it would fall to both the Township Trustees and an elected ‘Citizens Public Safety Council’ made up of elected citizens from a geographical boundary that engulfs every fourth Township that would also provide an additional council member for overly populated Townships, like the 5 that make up Fort Wayne and New Haven.
Unigov, or whatever they are going to eventually call it, is the way of the future. But we need to get out in front of it and guide it otherwise we will repeat all of the mistakes that Indy has made in the past including a pissing contest between the Mayor and the Sheriff every six to eight years.
Actually the merger idea is one whose time has come. Under Indiana statute it is just as easy to “merge” municipalities, if not easier, than it is to upgrade towns to cities or to modify the government structure of an existing city. Consider a merger of your city, Allen County and all of the township governments. Imagine all of the duplicated bureaucratic nonsense that could be eliminated. This new government entity could practically write its own charter of incorporation. This includes the plan of representation for the legislative branch, the powers of the executive branch (if any), allowance for the retaining of a professional, accredited municipal manager to handle staying on budget without the political aspirations to satisfy.
Your county could become a fine-tuned economic engine if everyone was pulling in the same direction.